Auto-Balance Idea: Getting Switched Late in the Map.... Very Frustrating! Is there a fairer way i.e. late joiners get moved first

[Danimal]

Hi all,

I was wondering if it would be possible to tweak the auto-balance system so that players who have been on a team from the start of a map are less likely to be switched late in the game. Instead, balance changes should prioritise moving players who joined midway through (or later), unless there really are no other options.

The reason I bring this up is that I have been switched quite a few times with only 3–5 minutes left, despite having played the entire map from the beginning. It feels especially unfair when someone who joined my team just minutes earlier gets to stay, while I get moved.

It is frustrating when you have spent the whole round fighting hard to support your team and push for the win, only to be pulled away at the last minute. For me, it is not just about SR (though that matters too), but about the time and effort invested in backing the team you started with.

I completely understand that balancing is important, and sometimes it is unavoidable that long-standing players get moved. But in most cases, I think it would feel fairer if late joiners were the first ones affected.

Just my two cents... curious to hear what others think.

[uips]

I agree with you. Imagine autobalance in soccer match where one player contributes to team whole match and in the end will be put to other team because other team is underperforming. 

 

Idk if there have been more changes made to autobalance but by default it should swap the player that joined most recently. Issue is or was that game considers each match as all the players joining in again. So the one who takes longest during map change is considered the most recent player even if u have played for hours

Edited 4 hours ago by uips

[lost]

I dont agree with some points:
1. Duration of being on the server should not be consider as the factor if someone should be or not moved, because many players are not playing for the win, but only for fun or just to harvest as many frags as they can

2. We want to avoid stacking teams, because most of the time, axis is stacked and allies is in the worse position

3. Why someone who joined to the server and prefer Team X, should be automatically moved to the other team ? Imagine situation, when for example someone with outstanding skill joined weaker team as last and after few minutes he is swapped to stronger one and make team balance even worse, so in my opinion randomness in choosing who will be swapped is ok

4. This is more like a joke so do not treat this serious: play allies all the time and you practically wont be swapped

5. Most of the people are angry about balance, because they are only thinking about their precious SR, but if someone will be swapped at the end of the map, such player won't lose SR (if he was swapped from stronger to weaker team, the same is when someone is swapped from weaker to stronger, such player wont gain SR)

6. The last thing - comparing autobalance in game to the soccer team is just not good example, if we were to talk about scrim match, yeah that would suck, but we are talking about public server. We are looking for a solution to make game fair for all players and it is very hard, because like I wrote AXIS is usually stacked by the players, because most of the time it is easier to defend than to attack. I heard many times the same explanation: I'm playing only axis.

[lost]

Maybe the simplest solution will be to disable autobalance when there will be only some % of the time left to the end of the map. Because usually this wont change anything if someone will be swapped 2-3 minute before end of the map.

[Danimal]

1 hour ago, lost said:

I dont agree with some points:
1. Duration of being on the server should not be consider as the factor if someone should be or not moved, because many players are not playing for the win, but only for fun or just to harvest as many frags as they can

2. We want to avoid stacking teams, because most of the time, axis is stacked and allies is in the worse position

3. Why someone who joined to the server and prefer Team X, should be automatically moved to the other team ? Imagine situation, when for example someone with outstanding skill joined weaker team as last and after few minutes he is swapped to stronger one and make team balance even worse, so in my opinion randomness in choosing who will be swapped is ok

4. This is more like a joke so do not treat this serious: play allies all the time and you practically wont be swapped

5. Most of the people are angry about balance, because they are only thinking about their precious SR, but if someone will be swapped at the end of the map, such player won't lose SR (if he was swapped from stronger to weaker team, the same is when someone is swapped from weaker to stronger, such player wont gain SR)

6. The last thing - comparing autobalance in game to the soccer team is just not good example, if we were to talk about scrim match, yeah that would suck, but we are talking about public server. We are looking for a solution to make game fair for all players and it is very hard, because like I wrote AXIS is usually stacked by the players, because most of the time it is easier to defend than to attack. I heard many times the same explanation: I'm playing only axis.

Thanks for the reply although I am not quite sure which parts you did agree with? 😉 

Duration of being on the server
I agree that the total time someone has been on the server should not matter. However, I do think the duration within a specific map or round should be a factor. That is why I felt U!p’s football analogy was a fair comparison imho. If you have been playing the whole match, it is different from just joining at half time or late on.

Stacking teams
I do not mind rebalancing at the start of a map (shuffles etc)  or early if teams end up stacked, but towards the end it feels unfair. For example, yesterday DC1 joined Axis midway through the match and I was then switched to Allies near the end, despite starting the map on Axis. Our SRs were very similar, but I was the one moved. That did not feel right and was just very annoying.

Moving skilled late joiners
I agree that it would be bad if someone with high skill joined the weaker team late and was then moved to the stronger team, making the imbalance worse. But in practice, that kind of situation seems rare. As you hinted with your Allies comment, players very rarely leave the stronger side, so auto-balance usually ends up targeting people who have been there from the beginning.

Playing Allies
Fair point... I have actually been playing Allies more in the past week but understand what you are saying... btw there are some players that just want to play allies so it works both ways. 

SR frustration
Just to clarify, SR can still be affected. A week ago on Frostbite, I was moved from Axis to Allies with only 3 minutes left. Axis then lost, and I dropped 0.18 SR. I went spec rather than continue. For me though, it is not only about SR...  I only play for the objective, which is why it is more frustrating. I never play for frags. From what I have seen, you seem more focused on frags, which might explain why we view this differently.

Football analogy
I understand your point about public servers being different from scrims, but I still think the principle holds. If you have put the time and effort into supporting your team from the start, it feels wrong to be pulled away right at the end.

And just to add, I completely agree with your point (which you often make in-game) that people switching teams mid-map just to join the stronger side is terrible for balance. I have never done that, and it definitely undermines fairness.

"Maybe the simplest solution will be to disable autobalance when there will be only some % of the time left to the end of the map. Because usually this wont change anything if someone will be swapped 2-3 minute before end of the map." I think it is better to keep numbers even and so i would be in favour of moving anyone who had joined the other team after the start of the map...

[lost]

55 minutes ago, Danimal said:

Thanks for the reply although I am not quite sure which parts you did agree with? 😉 

I agree with whole thread that autobalancing need to be somehow reimplemented, but cant see simple solution for now